Tuesday, April 08, 2008

DUAL DUEL


46 comments:

phuckie slum said...

Albania.
Nice touch on the eyes, Bosch.
Great concept and execution. Powerful, and symbolic of the flag.

Bosch Fawstin said...

Phuckie Slum,

Thank you. The idea of Islamic dualism is something I've thought about for a while now and this piece says it in spades.
I also have to mention that Killian's face here is from an older painting of mine, which I simply flipped into Salaam's face, adding slight differences. I always liked the striking design of the Albanian flag and the powerful mix of red and black.

phuckie slum said...

Memories,

Resentment, bitterness and hate are excellent characteristics to support closet nazis.

phuckie slum said...

I'm not sure who deleted Memories Of The Willow Tree comment, but it was "Jeez, talk about groveling", for commending Bosch's work.

I'll start quoting to keep it safe.

Bosch Fawstin said...

Phuckie Slum,

I deleted it, I'm going to try to make sure the little rat doesn't have the ability to bore us to death.

phuckie slum said...

No worries. Sly scums come and go, what can you do.

Bosch Fawstin said...

Just saw this story on LGF, which I title 'Ass Kiss in Damascus', about our first Anti-American president who seems determined to lock up the title of Worst President & Worst Ex-President in American history.

Damien said...

As usual your art work is excellent, Bosch!
Hmmm! I know who those two characters in the picture are. The one on the left is the creator of Pig Man,(Killian Duke) while the one on the right is brother (Salaam Duka). They are fighting over which path in life one should take. Reason and freedom of conscious or Islam and submission. The thing I don't get is what is the two headed bird with its tongues sticking out suppose to represent. I remember seeing it on a shirt worn by Salaam Duka in one of your past drawings. But if his brother is suppose to represent fundamentalist Islam in its purist form why would he have a picture on his shirt. I remember hearing somewhere that most radical Muslims don't even allow art. They are not even allowed to have pictures on the walls of mosques. Didn't the Taliban force this one guy to stop painting, even though his painting had nothing to with Islam? I thought I heard something like that somewhere. Is that creature suppose to a be the duke family crest? What is it anyway?

Bosch Fawstin said...

Damien,

First, thank you, glad you like the image.

The black two-headed eagle with red background is the flag of Albania, where the twin's family comes from.
Salaam wearing that flag on his shirt doesn't make him any less Muslim, and it's a good way for me to symbolize Islamic Dualism. And if you notice, Salaam added a crescent to his shirt of the Albanian flag, making it more Islamic than it is.

Damien said...

Thanks for letting me know, Bosch.

Bosch Fawstin said...

Damien,

You're welcome, thanks for the continued interest.

Mike Thompson said...

Great image, Bosch. Very striking! Wow! Also nice that you were able to reuse your older painting. Would make a great cover image.

Bosch Fawstin said...

Thanks, Mike, it definitely could be a cover.

Bosch Fawstin said...

To All:

There's a hidden image within the image, to be seen from an angle, to further the idea of Dualism. Don't want to spell it out.

Mike Thompson said...

I see PigMan and SuperJihad! Awesome! Gotta share how you did that. So great!

Bosch Fawstin said...

Mike,

It was serendipitous, as I did intend the image to be subtle, not invisible, from a straight view. Pretty cool.

Mike Thompson said...

Well you definitely tricked my eye, my friend. Very cool indeed.

Damien said...

Bosch

I have a wonderful idea for a character in your Infidel Novel. You don't have to use her, since its year story. But I think Salaam Duka should have a girl friend. I'll call her Lilly. You could come up with another name for her if you want. In addition to his conflict with his brother, as he embraces Islamism more and more, Salaam Duka could treat her worse and worse. It would help show his fall from "grace" so to speak. Before 9/11, before Salaam Duka embraced Islam, he could be very nice to Lily. Also Lily could be friends with Killian Duke. She could show some concern for his safety since a lot of people might want to harm him, because they are angry at his Pig Man cartoon. She could argue with him over whether or not it is worth the risk. This would add more depth and realism to your story. It would also make Killian Duke and Salaam Duka, seem more like real people. Real people have friends and love interests. I would also like to see how Salaam Dukas embracing Islamic Totalitarianism, and his conflict with brother is effecting other people, besides the two of them. You don't have to of course, its just a suggestion.

Damien said...

Oh Bosch, I forget

Have you heard of David Horowitz's Islam-o-Fascism awareness week? Its when all these famous and not so famous people in the anti-Jihad movement go to collage campuses and talk about the threat we face. The second Islam-o-Fascism awareness week started yesterday. Its run by the conservative FrontPageMag. They only did this once before. Go to the website below for more info.

http://www.frontpagemag.com/

Godfrey of Utah said...

Great and compelling image Bosch. In the back ground, I could see the outlines of the Twin Towers. It was upon closer inspection that I noticed Pigman and SuperJihad in the center. How close are you coming to publishing "The Infidel"?

Keep the art coming and us posted.
Thanks

phuckie slum said...

Oh wow! cool!
I'm not sure how it is really in the original, but it only became a tiny bit more noticeable when I brought the image into photoshop (I guess it used a certain color palette different than the PNG posted). I think you ought to spell it out just a few values more, so it's not virtually pitch black. Just enough so it's not immediately noticeable it's actually pigman and superjihad as their shadows

If you don't mind, my only critique is that the two black squares as the background for Duke And Salaam should go, and instead have the flag be the only mask of their faces (and further complete their heads, or fade them to black without cutting them off).

Either way, this is one of your greatest designs yet!

Bosch Fawstin said...

Damien,

While I appreciate your thoughts, this is my story in the end, it's not a collaborative effort. It either comes from who I am or it doesn't get told. There will be things some like and things some won't like, it's one man's story in the end. The only thing I can say is to wait for the story, and send me your your thoughts and feelings on it. And one girlfriend is too monogamous for Salaam.

Bosch Fawstin said...

Godfrey,

Glad you like the image.
On the book front.....
I didn't want to mention anything, but since you ask:
I am awaiting the response of a book publisher I've interested.
Their editor in cheif wanted to see more after hearing my breakdown of the book, even after I mentioned that not only does my book take on Jihad but Islam as well. That alone tells me this man has nerve, exactly what The Infidel needs. I will let you all know what comes of this soon as I get word.

Bosch Fawstin said...

phuckie slum,

Thanks a lot. I tried the image without the black frame and it did not look right. One possible reason is that the image is incongruent as it is, with the realistic faces within the sharp, graphic design. I decided that the black frame cements the faces into the image. And the way the necks of the eagle's heads flow right into the faces worked perfectly, even if I did touch it up a bit to really make it so.

Damien said...

Bosch

I knew it was your story. I even said it, was when I told you my idea. Anyway, I understand. Its your decision to make. I am not upset at all. I am just somewhat disappointed, but its okay. Like I said, its your story. By the way you didn't answer my question. Have you heard of Islam-o-Fascism awareness week? If so, I was just wondering what you thought of it.

Bosch Fawstin said...

Damien,

I've definitely heard of Islamo-Fascism Week, and while I think it has value, I think the title is a concession in the end to the politically correct powers that be, and so doesn't have the real effect it could have. Regardless of how it's justified, it's not a true definition of the threat we face.
Mohammed wasn't an Islamo-Fascist waging Jihadistism in the name of Islamism. I understand we have to start somewhere, but why not start with the full truth that it all begins with Islam, not some alleged perversion of it. Even if it was called 'Jihad Awareness Week', it'd be on far more solid ground and more powerful.

Damien said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Damien said...

Bosch,

Actually, you might be pleased to know that a few truly Anti-Islam speakers have participated In Islam-o-Fascism awareness week. In particular, Ann Coulter comes to mind. While you wouldn't completely agree with it, she's the one who made the infamous "We should invade their lands, Kill their leaders and convert them to Christianity." While you would a problem with a lot of her beliefs, she does not mince words when it comes to Islam. She is not politically correct. Not in the least.

Bosch Fawstin said...

Damien,

Believe me, if the truth can get out there and awaken some minds on campus, I'm all for it, they need the rude awakening their professors aren't giving. It's just that the name chosen softsells the true threat that it is Islam itself that's gunning for us, not some warped version of it. I don't question the legitimacy of those who may be involved, especially their anti-jihad credentials, such as Robert Spencer, I just think we do ourselves and the truth a real disservice when we call things what they are not. Islam is at war with us through its Jihad. Adding to that truth is only subtracting from it, and it lessons the shock to the system we desperately need.

Infidel K9 said...

Damien

You asked "The thing I don't get is what is the two headed bird with its tongues sticking out suppose to represent."

I will make it quite brief so as not to bore anyone

The two headed eagle is from Byzantine time, where Albania was between Rome and Constantinople, the to heads represents the eagle looking to both these two cities and swearing alliance to them

It was also the seal of Gjergj Kastriot Skanderbeg, a 15th century Albanian who led the revolt against the Ottoman Empire that resulted in brief independence for some regions of Albania from 1443 to 1478.

What most people fail to see is the final insult the moslems are making by claiming and using the flag as an old Ottoman flag as their symbol, and sadly Bosch reinforces here,(Albanian flag, making it more Islamic than it is) when in fact the horizontal open-winged eagle once symbolized the lack of submission of the highland Albanians to Isalmic conquest.

If you can remember a few post threads back, either you or PS where trying to teach me about the muzi/nazi connection

Well, when Al Banna formed his battilions in the Balkans, he called them the Skanderberg Division, not in memory of the great man, but to mock, and remind the Serbs and the Jews, of how ruthless the moslims wiped out the resistance, after Skanderbergs death.

If Bosch is really aiming for symbolism, he could have used the two blocks, not as the twin towes as he has done in previo s work, but used them some how to represent
Rome and Constantinople, one fallen, one still standing, despite the moslem attempts to take both.

Bosch Fawstin said...

Whatever historical reasons there are for the Albanian flag, as a symbol for this story, it works beautifully on numberous levels. The twin's Muslim family descend from Albania, the two heads emphasize Islamic dualism and the opposite directions of the eagle's heads symbolize the opposite directions the twin's take, post 9/11.

phuckie slum said...

Bosch,

I understand what you have done, I didn't share the experience of building the image, so I see your choices more clearly now! Thanks for replying back!

Damien said...

Thanks, Infidel K9

Bosch Fawstin said...

Turkey vs Pig

Damien said...

Bosch,

I believe I saw that article on Turkey shutting down Pig Farmers. It is kind of interesting how the government in that society is getting worse. I remember hearing for awhile that turkey was a largely secular society. In fact I thought I heard that for an Islamic country Turkey has been rather westernized, and respectful of individual rights.

Here's the url to a video of Robert Spencer. He's talking about how Turkey can resist Islamaficion. Copy the url to see the video.

http://hotair.com/archives
/2007/05/22/can-turkey-
resist-islamification/

While he basically shows that there are some genuine non violent, moderate Muslims, he also shows that the only way they can resist Radical Islam is through secularism.

What's happening in Turkey, while it might not seem like much, is somewhat disturbing on many levels. I hope this isn't a sign of much worse things to come. But at least there are a few rare instances of reasonable Muslims standing up to these violent technocrats.

Damien said...

I meant theocrats, not technocrats. Sorry

Bosch Fawstin said...

Damien, et al.,

Turkey's current crime minister, Erdogan, was thrown in the islammer for four months in 1998for inciting 'religious hatred', which is a clear indication about how times have changed in Turkey. He's also wise to Islam, in a story linked by JW last year:

'PM Erdogan commented on the term “moderate Islam”, often used in the West to describe AKP and said, ‘These descriptions are very ugly, it is offensive and an insult to our religion. There is no moderate or immoderate Islam. Islam is Islam and that’s it.” '


He's right about Islam, which makes him wrong for Turkey or for any leadership position on earth.

phuckie slum said...

Damien,

I actually disagree with RS about the situation in Turkey, although I'm can't really argue I know better than him. But from my experience with Turkish people in the past (and not just a handful), I recall a lot of them were consumed with anti-Semitic bias like 'Jews are cheap' when they told me carpet sales adventures. I don't know if it's a western anti-Semitic influence (I've also encountered lots of europeans filled with anti-Semitic bias as well), but what matters is the fact they were moonbats at best case scenario. Although I couldn't decisively conclude if they were disapproving of their country's ties with Israel, but in the last Israeli-Lebanon war, the Turkish public in its entirety exposed it's ugly face when it had vile and false protests similar to those in the terrortories, boycotting Israeli goods, mugging and lynching Israeli tourists.

Although I won't give them the benefit of the doubt, I will add that the international media, as well as arabic networks, were pretty much the main reason anti-Israel sentiments were so prominent in that war.

Damien said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Damien said...

Actually I define a moderate Muslim as someone, who rejects the violent and political aspects of Islam but still sees themselves as a Muslim. They practice what they see as spiritual Islam. They may take their religion seriously, but not very literally. They may be a walking contradiction of sorts, but they do exist. People are not always very logical. We can believe things that are contradictory, especially when it comes to religion. The moderates are westernized Muslims who arbitrarily reject the violence and hatred in their religion, while accepting the more pleasant parts. Perhaps a better term for them would be nominal Muslims. Many former Muslims were the so called moderates before they rejected Islam completely. What happened was they came to realize, just what their religion really meant, and how truly incompatible their way of thinking was with It. They simply stopped lying to themselves about its true nature.

phuckie slum said...

Demien,

Except a very few scattered and underground critiques of Islam or its "political" stances, the vast majority of the muslims, which includes the moderates, are basically part of the ummah. The moderates may be against theocracy or "political islam" in Turkey, but they are still ultra-supportive of the palestinazi terrorists. In fact, the so called "moderates" in the west bank are terrorists themselves, and not just the "military wings", but very much also the mobs themselves.

Some may be peaceful, which is good, even if they may not really want theocracy in their backyard, their allegiance is to the stances currently held in the muslim/arab world, which are the opposite to reality.

Westerners, however, have a wide diversity of thoughts and opinions and can indulge in whatever arguments they wish. Good luck finding anyone publicly coming out against Islam, terrorism (and not that ugly islamofascist rhetoric of "terrorism in all its forms", which leads to the blame of the west), jihad or support Israel like a former muslim such as Walid Shoebat.

Did I just write 'former' muslim? Yes, I did.
This is pretty much how far a muslim will have to go in order to be open minded. Being a westerner, whether atheist, christian or a jew, you can hold any line you want.

Almost all "moderate" muslims I stumbled upon (and worked with) clearly supported of the palestinazis and of course vindicated the Islamic / arab world in the big scope. They usually throw shallow covers like "I have many Jewish friends" or "Jews suffered throughout history" to appear cognitive and open minded.

Moderate islam is a derivative of moderate evil.
If Islam was a peaceful religion that teaches to turn the other cheek around, and suffering for others - basically, to be a moonbat, then moderate muslims would then be equivalent to seculars in the west.

Damien said...

phuckie slum,

I wasn't commenting on how rare or common they were. I was just pointing out that they do exist. And I do agree with you, most of the "moderate muslims" are not really moderate. But there are a few exceptions. Like Irshad Manji, She's A lesbian feminist and she wrote "The Trouble with Islam: A Muslim's Call To Reform Her faith."
The fact that she is an out of the closet lesbian, alone means she does not take Islam very literally, but I don't know how seriously she takes her personal faith.

I'd give the url to her book's Amazon.com webpage, but its too long.

I don't know how much good she will do in the long run, since the violent fundamentalist of her faith will always be able to portray themselves as the true Islam, as Robert Spencer has always said. For one thing the fundamentalists do practice a purer Islam. I do find it Ironic, that Mohammad (My he Roast In Hell) himself, would want her killed. Maybe she would do better if she abandoned her religion completely. But she clearly has a strong emotional attachment to it.

Plus, I have video of a show I taped, call Muslims Against Jihad. It was about some genuine moderate Muslims, resisting the fundamentalists. Again, I don't know how much good they will do.

I am not saying Islam is a good religion. I even have a book at home by Robert Spencer called "Religion of Peace, Why Christianity is and Islam Isn't." Believe me, I agree with the title, and much of its contents.

The way I explained my definition of Moderate Muslim makes it clear, that I don't really like Islam. But in away, the fact that there are some people who see themselves as Muslims, but they reject the political and violent aspects of their faith, says nothing about weather or not Islam is inherently peaceful or benign. It just says that there are people out there who see themselves as Muslims and accept the more benign portion of the faith but reject the rest. If the nominal Muslim was really being logical, he/she would either abandon their faith completely or became a violent Jihadist.

Damien said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Damien said...

No, let me clarify my last comment, if you are a moderate Muslim and you reject Jihad, the only way you can stay a peaceful Muslim and be logically consistent is if you find a way to condemn what Muhammad did, and still see him as a prophet. You can't deny the evil preached in certain passages in the Koran, the best you can do is as Robert Spencer pointed out, explain why they are no longer relevant at all. But than why is the Koran still relevant, and how could a benign God permit his prophet to do acts of pure evil, and preach evil in the first place?

Bosch Fawstin said...

Damien,

There's no way out of this moral mess that is Islam, for Muslims. They can be decent human beings, call themselves Muslims, not follow Islam in any serious way, but they are still connected to an evil religion that wants them on their knees and us dead. They are still in the service of Islam, perpetuating it’s evil by giving it a ‘good face’. Islam makes them look bad, but they make Islam look good, which makes their relationship symbiotic, with Islam getting far more out of the connection.
As to why the Koran is still relevant, the book is billed as the verbatim word of Allah, so how could the word of the Muslim God be dated? As to how could a benign God permit evil? Mohammed's Allah is a malevolent god who’s out for our blood. Muslim terrorists, however extreme they seem to us, are merely doing what all Muslims should be doing against us, according to Islam.

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